Stig Lindberg's influence on other designers

Kirkmodern

Fantastic vases ! I'm a fan of the Poole Freeform/Contemporary ranges but these are something else again.

Quick question for you. Every now and then I've heard a rumour that Stid Lindberg spent some time at Bitossi doing some vases for them for the American market under the Raymor brand. I've seen some Bitossi vases that are very similar to the "falling leaves" pattern so was wondering if this was actually true or whether Bitossi simply copied some is his designs. Do you know anything about this?

Kurt

I've never heard that rumour or seen it in print anywhere - how interesting - I'm sure Geoff (Kirkmodern) will know if it's true or not.

It's frustrating - I read about it a couple of times on American design chatrooms and didn't take a screen grab. Now, when I need it, I can't find anything. Here's one of the Bitossi vases in question. You can see the obvious similarity.

truk10 wrote:Kirkmodern

Fantastic vases ! I'm a fan of the Poole Freeform/Contemporary ranges but these are something else again.

Quick question for you. Every now and then I've heard a rumour that Stid Lindberg spent some time at Bitossi doing some vases for them for the American market under the Raymor brand. I've seen some Bitossi vases that are very similar to the "falling leaves" pattern so was wondering if this was actually true or whether Bitossi simply copied some is his designs. Do you know anything about this?

Kurt

Jefferson won a travel scholarship in 1952 visiting Scandinavia and meeting Stig Lindberg ,this influenced him greatly especially after working under Agnete Hoy when he was at art school in Milton

I'm a bit lost on this Dan. Jefferson arrived at Poole after the Freeform range ended.

truk10 wrote:It's frustrating - I read about it a couple of times on American design chatrooms and didn't take a screen grab. Now, when I need it, I can't find anything. Here's one of the Bitossi vases in question. You can see the obvious similarity.

I've had pieces with the same decoration but, as you say, they're Italian - mine all had 'Italy' on the base but funnily enough I've remarked to my husband in the past about the similarity in design to the Stig Lindberg pieces. I don't think they're Bitossi production however. I suspect that there might have been a bit of copying (or influencing) going on with regard to the decoration .... The Scandinavian designers are well known for influencing a lot of areas of design including pottery & glass.

sorry Kurt,I was speaking generally about the Scandinavian influence at Poole,both Guy Sydenham and Alan White have reproduced lots of scandi designs

As luck would have it, here's a lamp with the story that I'd heard ....

*LINK TO LIVE AUCTION REMOVED IN LINE WITH OUR COMMERCIAL POLICY*

I'm pretty sure I've seen one with Raymor written on it in the past.

Hi Pip
Is there any reason why you don't think their Bitossi? Here's another - different Lindberg style pattern but certainly looks like Bitossi pattern numbering to me.

http://www.hiandlomodern.com/IMAGES/CERAMIC/ITALIAN/stripedItalvase.jpg

So, at least to me, it seems pretty likely that Bitossi made them. And Bitossi have a history of getting outside artists come in . So it doesn't seem outside the bounds of reason that there might be a Stig Lindberg connection.

That style of hand numbering/base marking is in no way unique to Bitossi and was used by a *vast* number of potteries operating throughout Italy during the latter half of the 20th Century. It doesn't look like any Bitossi production I've seen and I'm afraid I'm still totally unconvinced these are from the Bitossi factory. Furthermore, the very knowledgable dealer who owns that item (who also sells a lot of Bitossi) has attributed it simply (and correctly in my view) as Italian - not Bitossi.

Kurt - I'm sorry but I've had to remove your link to the eBay auction - we don't allow commercial links on the forum if they're offering items for sale. However I looked at it first before removing it and, as with many eBay attributions it's vague, doesn't provide any evidence for the assumptions made and is merely one person's opinion - not fact. Unfortunately.

With regard to you having seen one with the Raymor label on it - entirely likely, since Raymor commissioned pottery from many Italian potteries (not just Bitossi) and rebranded them for sale in the US.

Pip wrote:Kurt - I'm sorry but I've had to remove your link to the eBay auction - we don't allow commercial links on the forum if they're offering items for sale. However I looked at it first before removing it and, as with many eBay attributions it's vague, doesn't provide any evidence for the assumptions made and is merely one person's opinion - not fact. Unfortunately.

With regard to you having seen one with the Raymor label on it - entirely likely, since Raymor commissioned pottery from many Italian potteries (not just Bitossi) and rebranded them for sale in the US.

Hi Pip

No problem - what's the correct etiquette for discussing items on ebay on this forum?

Regarding the description on the ebay item - Yes, I know the listing is vaque and not evidence of any link. This was the reason for my original post - to try to find out if it was any truth in it as I've heard it a number of times.

Kurt

Here's a link that explains the board position on commercial links

http://www.20thcenturyforum.com/how-to-use-this-forum-please-read-before-posting-f11/commercial-external-links-t5467.htm#44215

With regard to the Stig Lindberg/Bitossi 'myth' (let's call it that for now) - a large proportion of what I read on eBay I take with a huge sack of salt and you'll find once someone has said something it can get picked up and regurgitated as fact many times over and very quickly - the eBay self-perpetuating myth machine.

My position is I definitely don't believe they're Bitossi production but they *are* Italian (another factory obviously but which one I don't yet know). Whatever factory it was could well have been one that had dealings with Raymor so finding one with a Raymor sticker is perfectly possible/likely. They could also have had a connection with Stig Lindberg however - I don't know enough about him or what he did if/when he visited Italy and the potteries he may have worked for/with but my gut feeling is that the decoration on these have been inspired by his designs. But this is a gut feeling - not based on anything concrete.

First off - I don't have a definitive answer! My gut feeling is they are cheaply produced copies, made in Italy and of inferior quality. It is true that SL had a love of Italy, he used to holiday there and when he retired he moved to S.Felice Circeo where he died a couple of years later, in the biog from the National Museum in Stockholm is says that he opened his own small studio in Italy to produce his own work. I find it unlikely that a man who thought of himself as an artist, was at the forefront of the fight to get legislation to protect copyright for ceramics factories in Sweden would then end up banging out cheap badly made copies. I have handled a couple of the Raymor/Bitossi pieces and they don't have the quality of decoration or the vibrant colour of the originals. The only people who ever attribute these pieces to SL are people who are trying to sell them. There is a piece listed on a US site at the moment that states their lamp is signed 'Stig- made in Italy' - highly suspect. The bottom line for me is, if you are going to collect Stig Lindberg, then collect Stig Lindberg, the reason they are so sought after is because they are so good.

Geoff - do you have any evidence that they're Bitossi production? Apart from that point I agree with you completely.