C&CP Art Union Moon Flask - Thomas Battam & Son

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C&CP Art Union Moon Flask - Thomas Battam & Son

Post by cookiepops on September 7th 2014, 6:27 pm

Have had this for a few years now and picked it up again the other day hoping to properly ID it.  I have Googled C & CP Art Union and the net seems to bring up a big fat zero.  There seems to be an impressed triangle mark under the word "the" on the second line so I thought I would look for that mark instead......nope.....coming up with absolutely nothing, apart from a site which links me to a Dutch Rijks Museum painting site.    Have tried to accentuate the triangle mark on image. Any ideas anyone please?



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Re: C&CP Art Union Moon Flask - Thomas Battam & Son

Post by studio-pots on September 7th 2014, 6:49 pm

I wouldn't rule out Minton - they used impressed marks, including triangles for the date.

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Re: C&CP Art Union Moon Flask - Thomas Battam & Son

Post by big ed on September 7th 2014, 7:11 pm

I agree with John , Minton for me the form matches other pieces by them .

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Re: C&CP Art Union Moon Flask - Thomas Battam & Son

Post by big ed on September 7th 2014, 7:12 pm

http://www.veniceclayartists.com/tag/pilgrim-flask/

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Re: C&CP Art Union Moon Flask - Thomas Battam & Son

Post by cookiepops on September 7th 2014, 7:24 pm

oooo I wondered about that and also Coalport. Shall have to have a look in my Goddens book for the marks. Can't understand the reference to the Art Union though, could it have been a piece for the Museum perhaps?
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Re: C&CP Art Union Moon Flask - Thomas Battam & Son

Post by studio-pots on September 7th 2014, 7:34 pm

It could have been a commission for the Art Union or a blank decorated by a BS from the Art Union.

Even if the flask was made by Minton, it isn't the end of the story.

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Re: C&CP Art Union Moon Flask - Thomas Battam & Son

Post by cookiepops on September 7th 2014, 7:40 pm

BS ????
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Re: C&CP Art Union Moon Flask - Thomas Battam & Son

Post by NaomiM on September 7th 2014, 7:48 pm

Art Union may refer to a subscription. Parian figures, in particular, were made and sold to art lovers who had pledged to buy them. When the artist (or museum or collector's group) had been promised enough to cover costs, then the item would be put into production at one of the factories who could produce the quality desired. Some subscribers would sign up to a series of payments, paid over the course of the year, and would receive an art work each month or so, or one major art work at the end of the year. Classical Greece and religious themed items like this one, were especially popular. Non-fiction books, such as encyclopaedias on birds and animals full of hand printed and coloured plates, were also published by this method.

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Re: C&CP Art Union Moon Flask - Thomas Battam & Son

Post by denbydump on September 7th 2014, 8:03 pm

I have found the exact vase, Minton, shape 1348, in my Dresser book, with different
decoration of course!
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Re: C&CP Art Union Moon Flask - Thomas Battam & Son

Post by studio-pots on September 7th 2014, 8:18 pm

............ and the triangle looks to date it to 1879 (if not 1878).

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Re: C&CP Art Union Moon Flask - Thomas Battam & Son

Post by denbydump on September 7th 2014, 9:30 pm

Minton did sell blanks to other potteries, so if it's not marked Minton it could be a blank.
2 vases in my collection from this period are marked Minton, but the mark is a tiny,
lightly impressed "MINTON" in capitals, hard to see.
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Re: C&CP Art Union Moon Flask - Thomas Battam & Son

Post by r-and-f on September 8th 2014, 1:30 pm

As Naomi says, Art Unions were clubs where art-loving members of the Victorian bourgeoisie paid regular subscriptions to be sent art reproductions such as limited-edition engravings, bronze medallions, etc. Membership also gave entry to raffles for which special one-off prizes were awarded. I wonder if this wonderful flask might have been a special commission from Mintons to be offered as a raffle prize by the C&CP Art Union?

But I can't work out what C&CP stands for. It might possibly have been an art union with religious connections, hence the commissioned picture being a scene from The Pilgrim's Progress.

See [url]http://www.victorianlondon.org/entertainment/artunionoflondon.htm[url]
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Re: C&CP Art Union Moon Flask - Thomas Battam & Son

Post by Mordeep on October 13th 2016, 9:29 am

I know this is an ancient post but I have been doing some research on a lovely pair of vases and I thought I would share what I have found so the next person who googles C & CP art union gets more information.





As others have said the Art unions sprang up in the early 1800's as a way for people with an interest in the arts to sponsor art for a regular monthly or annual fee. People in the union would receive medals and books connected with the arts. They would also be entered into draws to win works of art commissioned by the Union from artists of the day. I am sorry to say that these Unions are poorly recorded and little is known about them. Most people only encounter them when they come across a work of art with an art union stamp or plaque and wonder what it means. I am not sure the reason but it appears most appear to have faded out by the 1890's. What is clear though is that they share very close relations with certain companies. The most striking relationship is between Art Union of London and Doulton. 90% of all art union items I come across are made by Doulton for the art union of London. To give you an idea of scale the art Union of London are reported to have had 20'000 members in 1876.

The ones I have here and the moon flask in the first post are not the art union of London though. They are for the Crystal palace art Union. Formed in 1858 the union changed it's name to the Ceramic Crystal Palace art Union in 1865 hence the C & CP. The maker took me a while to find though. A misleading auction attribute on the web links its with a company called Bishop & Stonier who formed in 1878 and used a similar mark. But if you have a dig on the crystal palace art union you come across an awful lot of Parian Copeland figures (it appears to be the main lottery item by this union). If you dig a little further you come across Thomas Battam, and his son Thomas Battam jnr who formed the Union in 1858 and are listed as the founder and president. Turns out Thomas was also described as a "china-guilder" in records of the day working at Copeland and Spode. He also seems to have had ceramic company that went on to the 1870's called Battam & Son. So I am 95% certain that what I have and the moon flask above are lottery prizes from the art union of Crystal Palace hand painted by Battam & son on I assume bought in plain white blanks. They are stunning as is the moon flask. I guess like our present day lottery funding if a lot of people to pay a little then you can sometimes get great things made that otherwise would not exist.
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Re: C&CP Art Union Moon Flask - Thomas Battam & Son

Post by NaomiM on October 14th 2016, 1:33 am

Great research. I've amended the title but if you'd like it changed to something else let me know. I'll move it into the British Pottery forum in due course.

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Re: C&CP Art Union Moon Flask - Thomas Battam & Son

Post by Mordeep on October 14th 2016, 5:42 am

Thanks NaomiM

These art unions are fascinating. I had previously thought them like charities with noble aims for spreading love for art. I suppose they had that aspect to them but they seem much more commercial than that when you look closely. The Crystal Palace art union I found out was a private organization not a charity at all and every member got a parian Copeland statue or could upgrade to a large statue for a price (that bits a bit fuzzy) every year. Sounds a lot like a company that made money by selling art. The link between unions and makers becomes easier to understand when you think it was also a way for a company like Copeland to sell a load of very expensive statues.

I will keep my eye out as I come across bits of information I will add it here.
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